Starter options?? - Harley Davidson Forums: Harley Davidson Motorcycle Forum
 25Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 27 (permalink) Old 11-10-2018, 10:46 PM Thread Starter
Outlaw
 
Doc M's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: South Texas
Posts: 546
Garage
Starter options??

Sometimes you end up with years of experience working against you, and the one thing I forgot about with the S&S 107 upgrade is the starter limitations on the 98 FLHP. Fact is I have 2 of the 2.0kw starters on hand and it never crossed my mind they wouldn't fit.

Of course I'm sure working on it while running a low grade fever with a puke bucket handy didn't help in thinking it through. LoL

Anyway, I'm looking for ideas. I know a few have done the big inch engines on touring models, so which starter will fit and have the torque to start this beast?? Or is de-tuning the only option??

And no, I haven't tried a fresh starter yet, or ruled out that the starter I'm using is probably original to the bike and as tired as the old 80 inch engine was.
slingshot383 likes this.

I want to die in my sleep like my grandfather, not yelling and screaming like the passengers in his car.

When I was a child, I thought nap time was punishment.
Now it's like a mini-vacation.

What doesn't kill you sometimes make you stronger,
and sometimes it just pisses you off!!
Doc M is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 27 (permalink) Old 11-11-2018, 06:47 AM
Retired citizen
 
SCHMIDTY's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Port Wash.,WI
Posts: 21,540
Garage
A 1.4kW should do the trick. Or the stock starter with comp. releases. Could also use the 86 tooth ring and pinion setup with the stock starter.
slingshot383 likes this.

Disclaimer : Don't believe anything I say unless you are absolutely sure that I know what I'm talking about .
SCHMIDTY is online now  
post #3 of 27 (permalink) Old 11-11-2018, 07:58 AM
Proud Infidel
 
Alan S's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Southcentral LA
Posts: 2,386
My stock starter (with compression releases) cranks the 107 easily when it's cold. I think a hot start's gonna be different, though, if I ever get this critter on the road.

Sent from my 2 Tin Cans With A String using Tapatalk
slingshot383 likes this.

What is freedom of expression? Without the freedom to offend, it ceases to exist.
Salman Rushdie
Alan S is online now  
 
post #4 of 27 (permalink) Old 11-11-2018, 11:53 AM Thread Starter
Outlaw
 
Doc M's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: South Texas
Posts: 546
Garage
One option could be as simple as going back to the BDL Belt drive. I did some calculations this morning and here's what I came up with (and granted these figures are not exact).

With the stock primary system the ratio between the front and rear sprockets works out to 1:1.760
With the BDL Enclosed belt drive the ratio works out to 1:1.444

I'll take a moment for perspective for the folks who may not understand those numbers, if your spinning the clutch end (where the starter is) at a steady 1000 RPM's, the stock chain system will turn the crank at 1760 RPM's, and this BDL system will turn is slower at 1444 RPM's, thus the starter doesn't have to work as hard to crank the engine.

As a bonus the BDL system also uses the 86 tooth ring and pinion which will also help a little.


Quote:
Originally Posted by SCHMIDTY View Post
A 1.4kW should do the trick. Or the stock starter with comp. releases. Could also use the 86 tooth ring and pinion setup with the stock starter.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan S View Post
My stock starter (with compression releases) cranks the 107 easily when it's cold. I think a hot start's gonna be different, though, if I ever get this critter on the road.

You both hit on something that would help, but since this engine was originally built by American Ironhorse, it's got the 96" heads and not set up for compression release. Their solution included the 86 tooth ring and pinion with the 2.0kw starter.

And Alan, hot starts are a big concern for me at this point, I can't believe this engine doesn't have any compression release, yours should be ok so long as we can sort it all out.

And don't get me wrong when I say I'm not happy with the BDL system, but there is a fair bit of pulse transfer with it and adding the 107 should (at least in my mind) add a hell of a lot of pulse. But if I'm going back to that setup, it's getting brand new hubs on both ends so I can get the smoothest ride I can get.

So my 2 day job (that's already into it's like 4th or fifth day due to being sick) is going to take another week by the time I get a new starter and hubs for the belt drive. Not to mention the cookie jar is empty. (anyone want to buy a nice cookie jar?? LMAO)

Unless anyone has another solution???
slingshot383 likes this.

I want to die in my sleep like my grandfather, not yelling and screaming like the passengers in his car.

When I was a child, I thought nap time was punishment.
Now it's like a mini-vacation.

What doesn't kill you sometimes make you stronger,
and sometimes it just pisses you off!!
Doc M is offline  
post #5 of 27 (permalink) Old 11-12-2018, 11:13 PM Thread Starter
Outlaw
 
Doc M's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: South Texas
Posts: 546
Garage
Ok, 1.4kw starter is on it's way, and I left a message for Dan at BDL but I think they are closed on Mondays anyway. I'm going to speak with him to make damn sure I'm getting the right stuff the first time.

The bad part is I'm going to miss out on a 300+ mile ride this weekend for a family gathering, I'm not taking a cage and the EG has been sitting around too much and only making short runs so she's not making any road trips without full spring service I failed to give it last spring. Poor thing is probably at the outer limit for an oil change too.

The more I think on it the more sense it makes to go this route, take as much load as I can off the starter and it should be fine. Plus I don't get that "Needs another gear" feeling until I get over 85mph with this belt drive primary. And I just don't ride that fast anymore anyway. (if you believe that I might have a great real estate opportunity for you)
slingshot383 likes this.

I want to die in my sleep like my grandfather, not yelling and screaming like the passengers in his car.

When I was a child, I thought nap time was punishment.
Now it's like a mini-vacation.

What doesn't kill you sometimes make you stronger,
and sometimes it just pisses you off!!
Doc M is offline  
post #6 of 27 (permalink) Old 11-13-2018, 03:23 PM Thread Starter
Outlaw
 
Doc M's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: South Texas
Posts: 546
Garage
Ok, needed parts ordered from BDL, of all the money I've spent on this bike, this feels like the most brutally painful. I can't explain why, it's only a few hundred to BDL and that's chump change compared to what I've spent this for on this project. And trust me, it has nothing to do with BDL, I have nothing but good things to say about them, it's more about the nickle and dime BS biting me in the arse.

Maybe instead of just buying parts, I should have bought a whole new belt drive system, then I'd feel better. LMAO

No, wait,,,, if I went with a whole new belt drive then I'd have to go for something like a bad ass 6", which would mean I would have to go bigger on the engine, widen the ass end of the bike to accommodate a wider rear tire,,,,,,,,, Maybe I'm better off only spending a few hundred and being depressed!! ROTFL
Kainam, slingshot383 and JLR like this.

I want to die in my sleep like my grandfather, not yelling and screaming like the passengers in his car.

When I was a child, I thought nap time was punishment.
Now it's like a mini-vacation.

What doesn't kill you sometimes make you stronger,
and sometimes it just pisses you off!!
Doc M is offline  
post #7 of 27 (permalink) Old 11-16-2018, 10:40 PM Thread Starter
Outlaw
 
Doc M's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: South Texas
Posts: 546
Garage
Well all the parts arrived today and it's almost ready to ride, I'm sure the neighbor across the road was happy when I quit about 9:30 tonight.
This appears to have solved the starter issue, even let it run for about 15 min, shut it off for maybe 2 min and it came back to life as soon as I touched the button. Just wish I had the stamina to finish buttoning things up tonight.

Sadly, I gotta work elsewhere tomorrow but Sunday should see it on the road again. Just from running it on the lift table there is a huge difference, it's no longer just a mild mannered little ride, but a beast jumping at it's lashes holding it to the lift table and almost ready to be unleashed on the road.

One side note, unlike the 80, it feels pretty smooth when revved up a little, of course the real test will be in how it rides but I think the larger flywheels in this 107 are compensating for the engine pulse I felt with the BDL belt drive. And the new parts were a really nice, tight fit which should also be helping with what I was feeling.

I want to die in my sleep like my grandfather, not yelling and screaming like the passengers in his car.

When I was a child, I thought nap time was punishment.
Now it's like a mini-vacation.

What doesn't kill you sometimes make you stronger,
and sometimes it just pisses you off!!
Doc M is offline  
post #8 of 27 (permalink) Old 11-19-2018, 04:11 PM Thread Starter
Outlaw
 
Doc M's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: South Texas
Posts: 546
Garage
(insert profanity laced rant)

Finally concluded I have the wrong insert for the front pulley, used the flush before so I ordered a new flush, but I need the 1/4 inch offset.

Dan at BDL did offer to simply replace the one I bought with the one I need without any restocking fee if I sent it back to him, but I opted to just order the right one so it will hopefully be here in a couple of days and I can go for a ride.

It's entirely my fault, and as always dealing with BDL is as good as can be. I just should have measured everything before ordering rather than assuming everything would be exact between the stock engine and charging system and this 107 with the compufire charging system.
Kainam likes this.

I want to die in my sleep like my grandfather, not yelling and screaming like the passengers in his car.

When I was a child, I thought nap time was punishment.
Now it's like a mini-vacation.

What doesn't kill you sometimes make you stronger,
and sometimes it just pisses you off!!
Doc M is offline  
post #9 of 27 (permalink) Old 11-20-2018, 09:09 AM
Proud Infidel
 
Alan S's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Location: Southcentral LA
Posts: 2,386
Have you checked the pulley alignment? I had to add around .165 in spacers to get the 107 lined up with my stock clutch basket.

Mine finally starts/runs. Got the primary off to fix a leak at the o-ring. And the wheels are off for blasting/painting, new bearings, seals and tires.

Rain everyday makes sucks for blasting.

Sent from my 2 Tin Cans With A String using Tapatalk

What is freedom of expression? Without the freedom to offend, it ceases to exist.
Salman Rushdie
Alan S is online now  
post #10 of 27 (permalink) Old 11-20-2018, 12:04 PM Thread Starter
Outlaw
 
Doc M's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: South Texas
Posts: 546
Garage
That's the one thing I didn't do when going back to the BDL belt drive, I had to use some parts from a softail to make the stock primary line up so you would think I would have been smart enough to check things with the belt drive before ordering parts and putting it back on.

The tracking shows the new insert will be here Friday so I'm working on some little piddly things, and thinking real hard about adding this Carlini torque arm that's sitting here, but that means the right floorboard and pipe need to come back off to do it. At this point it's been sitting on the table so long it's even got proper wiring and plug for the trailer hitch, geeze no more dangling, jury rigged trailer plug, I won't know how to act!!

I want to die in my sleep like my grandfather, not yelling and screaming like the passengers in his car.

When I was a child, I thought nap time was punishment.
Now it's like a mini-vacation.

What doesn't kill you sometimes make you stronger,
and sometimes it just pisses you off!!
Doc M is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Harley Davidson Forums: Harley Davidson Motorcycle Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
starter VS starter clutch getmoneyHD Electrical 6 09-05-2013 06:49 PM
anybody put a remote starter button on their starter flatblack Sportster General Discussions 28 12-11-2011 11:42 AM
Nightster seat options JStreitz Sportster General Discussions 8 06-27-2010 05:46 PM
Seat Options NCHogg Dyna General Discussions 5 09-01-2008 06:07 AM
VRSC Bigger Bore Options From the Factory? sfarson VRSC General Discussions 23 02-20-2008 03:43 AM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome