Harley Davidson Forums banner

1 - 10 of 10 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
541 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
I've been to three dealerships owned by different, well, owners. Each one of them tells me that (1) a PowerCommander III will destory my ECU over time, (2) that I need to spend $550 for their "race tuner" (a.k.a., SERT), and (3) that if I install the parts myself, I'll probably void my warranty. (They seem to hate it when I know it’s called “SERT” too!)

I'm 24 years old, so I'm a young guy compared to most Harley owners and dealership staff. I have a 2009 XL1200N. I want to get the V&H sideshots and a high-flow intake (perhaps the AN Big Sucker or some variation of a cone/90* intake filter using the K&N filter). That's it... so basically, Stage I. I want noise and power, because frankly the XL1200N is too quiet and doesn't have enough middle- and top-end balls.

Are there any freakin' honest dealerships in Illinois that someone can recommend? When I go into these dealerships and talk about what I want to do and even mention a PCIII or that I’ve done some research on the internet, they literally have the nerve to ask me what I do, and then say that if they tried to do what I do, they'd probably get 10% right and then use that "point" as justification to ask why I question their suggestions! First that's rude. Secondly, I'm a customer, and I have the right to ask questions... plus I know my way around engines! (I building an old Softail from a frame I bought off the side of the road. Sure I'll need help here and there, but I get it and, for that matter, I know what EFI is!) Not to mention, Harley dealerships are known for overpricing and gouging customers and they are all threatened by customers’ use of the internet before coming in and buying parts. Hell, you can’t even buy Harley parts from an authorized dealership accept on eBay! My gosh, let’s get modern here!

Anyway, a PowerCommander simply cannot harm the stock ECU unless the stock ECU is defective or poorly designed from the get-go. The PCIII does not send a current in the direction of the ECU (or at all), so the ECU doesn't even know it's there. Perhaps, perhaps the ECU could get harmed because of the extra wire resistance due to there being more wire length and a PCIII in-between it and the EFI, but I'd argue that the ECU should be designed to handle variations in power because it's on a damn motorcycle!

Am I convinced nothing can go wrong with a PCIII? No. But I'm pretty sure $550 for a software program (SERT) is a rip-off, considering you have to pay the dealer to do remaps when you need one, they won’t give me the tools to update maps on my own, and considering many race teams use PCIIIs purposely over any sort of SERT or SERT-like tool; it’s a tested technology. Not to mention, you should be able to just flash the ECU to a certain degree with a richer fuel mixture map. It'd be close enough...

Am I convinced every single H-D shop I've been to in order to inquire about V&H Sideshots and a good intake is treating me like I'm a 2-year-old? Yes! They quote me on-the-spot at $1,300 for everything and separately say the SERT/Dyno tune is $550. So, if I were to buy V&H Sideshots (~$550, if I’m lucky) and, say, the Screamin' Eagle cone/90* intake or any other similar one ($300), that adds up to $850 (not to mention, if I get the SE cone, I'd need to by a K&N filter because the SE filter blows). $1300 - $850 = $450. So there's at least $100 unaccounted for, plus tax, plus this, plus that surely!

I'm almost ready to go to a Victory dealership and see if they'll talk straight. And considering Victory motors are in essence similar enough to H-D motors, and a lot of Victory riders are dejected H-D riders, I think they'll be willing to help!

And, for God’s sakes, why does every Harley dealership tell me something different until I prod them? For example, I was thinking of just putting some slip-ons on the bike. One tells me Reinharts break all the time (another swears by them, even over V&H), another insists I won’t like muffler XYZ (yet they admitted to never hearing it), and another tells me, when I inquire about the V&H Sideshots, that I won’t like them (umm, that’s for me to decide). They all seem to like Cycle Shack slips? One says I don’t need a map. The other says I do. One says no matter what I do I need the SERT. Well, that’s just evidence right there I’m getting horsed around.

Hell, I'm almost ready to just hawk my 2009 XL1200N and go buy a Victory because so far H-D has treated me like I've never come across a salesman, an engine, an EFI, or a two-wheeled vehicle before. Hell I wonder if they think I’m still breast feeding! For God’s sakes, I am a salesman myself... I know the tricks! Not to mention, the bike already as problems at 2,000 miles including rough idle (almost turns off at times), pinging under load (93 octane BP gas), and a transmission issue (or issues; sticks in-between 1st and N and feels like I'm pushing through something between 1 and 2). It simply isn't a refined machine. It should be, considering it's an age-old design and an age-old engine technology! Why does GM still use pushrod technology? Because it works, and works well. (Unfortunately everything else breaks on a GM.)

So, if anyone has any advice to help, that'd be great. I’m thinking of just waiting until after the warranty runs out to do any modifications to the drive train. Then I won’t have to go to the dealer for anything and find out they won’t “cover it” because a PCIII is there. Spare me! Have faith in your product, Harley dealerships! I don’t go back to dealerships that shit on me while I’m there… and that means I don’t by the $70 this and $300 thats from them!

On a side note, just to make this post longer, I can see why people my age who understand the financial markets refuse to buy H-D stock! They're whole business model is dependant on a culture of HOG enthusiasts who are 45-50 years old on average. I try hanging out with HOG chapter members at my age, and I'm an outcast - they don't like that I'm there, and I'm a nice guy interested in them, their bikes, and Harley culture. In the end though, I really don't want to hang out with 50 year olds on pretty much only baggers just to ride with other Harley riders. Almost everyone I know has a crotch rocket, and if they have a Harley, they feel the same way I do.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
40,766 Posts
You don't say what part of IL....

I hear many good things about Chicago HD, they're also a 20% off parts dealer over the internet.

Check this site for comments about other dealers in your area.
http://www.stealer-dealer.com/sd_IL.htm
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
350 Posts
Chicago HD in Glenview also another very good dealer is Lake Shore Harley. I have never had problems with either, if you plan to have any motorwork done I would choose Lake Shore as they are known for there work.



You don't say what part of IL....

I hear many good things about Chicago HD, they're also a 20% off parts dealer over the internet.

Check this site for comments about other dealers in your area.
http://www.stealer-dealer.com/sd_IL.htm
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
541 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
Lake Shore is the shop where the salesman literally insulted me with the whole "what do you do..." comment. I suppose I shouldn't have been insulted by it, but it wasn't necessary to say. I simply wanted to talk options... and they only were interested in talking about one. Mention anything else, and they talked over me and got loud and quick to shoot anything I had to say down. I hope they're great with motor work though because my bike is going to be sitting in their garage getting looked at! :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
21 Posts
I have an 09 Nightster as well, I got the same story from my dealer, they might have even quoted me for the "SERT". I talked to a good buddy of mine who is a mechanic at the local Yamaha shop, he said to use the PCIII, I agreed. Ive got some short shots and the SE heavy breather on order, ill install it all and program it up myself, screw the dealership, seems like its just another way for them to gouge us young HD owners. Hopefully the PCIII will work fine and I wont have any probs, if not, I might have to go back to the dealership with my tail between my legs, and have to pay out of pocket for "un-authorized" motor upgrades, but im willing to take that chance.
 

·
I break stuff.
Joined
·
1,669 Posts
Lake Shore... LOL

Skip the sales "staff". Call the service department and ask to speak with John.

Trust me.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
277 Posts
Chicago HD

Kainam, You mentioned 20% off at Chicago HD. I needed a windshield so I gave them a whirl. It was out of stock but they still had it at my door in seven business days. Saved 75 bucks. Thanks a bunch. We may be two of a kind, I have a Harley, own a BAR and carry.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
40,766 Posts
Well done. It's nice to see that there are still businesses that know what customer service is!
 
1 - 10 of 10 Posts
Top