[jamesps47]

My 2006 FLSTCI started to make a new noise on a ride I was on and it bothered me. I know all harleys make noise but this one was new and I did not like it. A few blocks before I got home it started running bad and the oil light came on. I just checked the oil at the last fuel stop an it was fine but now the tank is empty. No sign of any leaks. I pulled the drain plug out of the crank case and found the oil. The first thing I think is the cam chain tensioners have gone and taken out the oil pump. I opened up the cam chest and to my surprise the tensioners were perfect. Something is wrong so I keep going. When I got the cam support plate cams and oil pump out it was very clear wht happened. The rear inner INA cam bearing was gone except for 3/4 of the race tht was now turning in the hole with the cam. I have been doing research on the failure and have found out it's not that uncommon. If you have changed your own cams you probably had the parts guy tell you that you need to upgrade to torrington bearings even though the INA bearings come in the kit for the cam change. As it turns out this is just another issue of the MOCO bean counters saving a dime and the customers who lay down good hard earned money to own a part of the legend have to put out more cash to cover their mistakes. Thanks for listening, I had to get that of my chest.
James

 

[Dave63]

How many miles on bike and how long did you drive it after you first heard the noise? The new TC INA has a metal inner cage, unlike the older plastic version seen in the Evo engine.

As well......some 88 cams have been seen delaminating on the journal end, leading to failures not caused by the bearing, rather due to poor cam castings.

I can tell you already you didn't turn it off when you heard the noise. Continued driving allows the cam bearing to grind through and then the cam drops away from the pushrods, not allowing that cylinder's valves to open all the way. It doesn't happen in a block or two.......

Catastrophic failure at its worse is the cam wears through the bearing cage or the outer cage spins. Either way the right case half is ruined and has to be replaced.

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[ciscokid]

wow man thats not good

 

[Lone_Rider]

How many miles on bike and how long did you drive it after you first heard the noise? The new TC INA has a metal inner cage, unlike the older plastic version seen in the Evo engine.

As well......some 88 cams have been seen delaminating on the journal end, leading to failures not caused by the bearing, rather due to poor cam castings.

I can tell you already you didn't turn it off when you heard the noise. Continued driving allows the cam bearing to grind through and then the cam drops away from the pushrods, not allowing that cylinder's valves to open all the way. It doesn't happen in a block or two.......

Catastrophic failure at its worse is the cam wears through the bearing cage or the outer cage spins. Either way the right case half is ruined and has to be replaced.

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When I had the independent wrench do the cam, bearing, pushrods, lifters and sparkplugs on my Softail today he commented on how glad he was that I had decided to do the cams and stuff because my 97 had one of those plastic type bearings in it. He said that with 65k on the bike I was pretty lucky it hadn't exploded yet.

James, have you been able to get any estimates on the price of replacing that side?

 

[Hillsidecycleco]

My 2006 FLSTCI started to make a new noise on a ride I was on and it bothered me. I know all harleys make noise but this one was new and I did not like it. A few blocks before I got home it started running bad and the oil light came on. I just checked the oil at the last fuel stop an it was fine but now the tank is empty. No sign of any leaks. I pulled the drain plug out of the crank case and found the oil. The first thing I think is the cam chain tensioners have gone and taken out the oil pump. I opened up the cam chest and to my surprise the tensioners were perfect. Something is wrong so I keep going. When I got the cam support plate cams and oil pump out it was very clear wht happened. The rear inner INA cam bearing was gone except for 3/4 of the race tht was now turning in the hole with the cam. I have been doing research on the failure and have found out it's not that uncommon. If you have changed your own cams you probably had the parts guy tell you that you need to upgrade to torrington bearings even though the INA bearings come in the kit for the cam change. As it turns out this is just another issue of the MOCO bean counters saving a dime and the customers who lay down good hard earned money to own a part of the legend have to put out more cash to cover their mistakes. Thanks for listening, I had to get that of my chest.
James

We've repaired/machined those many times.
Scott

 

[Silverback]

Are the stock inner cam bearings on a 2004 Road King INA or Torrington? I have 60K on the clock -- how worried should I be? I changed the cam tensioner shoes at 50K and they felt good. I did not change the inners because I did not have access to the tool. I did have the dealer change the outer bearings in the support plate. I have good oil pressure.

--

 

[Hillsidecycleco]

Are the stock inner cam bearings on a 2004 Road King INA or Torrington? I have 60K on the clock -- how worried should I be? I changed the cam tensioner shoes at 50K and they felt good. I did not change the inners because I did not have access to the tool. I did have the dealer change the outer bearings in the support plate. I have good oil pressure.

--

INA.
Scott

 

[prodrag1320]

also repaired too many to count,way stronger than stock when done.no welding either
http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p79/veetwin1/000_0001-7.jpg
http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p79/veetwin1/000_0024-7.jpg

 

[Dave63]

When I had the independent wrench do the cam, bearing, pushrods, lifters and sparkplugs on my Softail today he commented on how glad he was that I had decided to do the cams and stuff because my 97 had one of those plastic type bearings in it. He said that with 65k on the bike I was pretty lucky it hadn't exploded yet.

James, have you been able to get any estimates on the price of replacing that side?

Evo INA was plastic cage. TC INA is metal.

 

[Fairshake]

I'm surprised that you did not go for the TC88 update camplate change over. It requires you to buy two of the bearings needed but comes with the 2007 and later oil pump plus the new cam plate and bearings. Your oil pressure is increased by 40% and you have the new hydraulic chain tensioners instead of the spring type the bike came with. I torn my 2004 RK bike down with just 12,000 miles and the outer tensioner was over half way gone. Harley really dropped the ball with this design. Later Fairshake

 

["99"WG.]

Harley Davidson should at the very least do a inspection of the cam-chain tensioners + cam bearings...of course free of charge one time to a current owner of the TC.88ci motors and if they are questionable then one can proceed from there.I heard somewhere that Harley doesn't even recommend any periodic chk. of these components...mmm! imagine that! Now I'm not a hatter of Harley's,but I do remember back in the 80's when they lobbied for the import tariff's on Japanese bikes that helped them from possibly going under...at least that's the way I heard it. I paid that extra cost on 5 of my Japanese motorcycles,because at the time I wanted to go fast and not wrench on them when I parked them in the garage,but they did get their act together with the rubber mounts and more dependability. I've always loved the wide glide models from day one and now believe it or not I am the proud owner of a 99 dyna WG.
All I can say in closing is ANY HD.dealer that wants to charge me $1400.00 to install the cam chain tensioner upgrade kit is crazy!
Seems like a S#@T load of money for a $500.00 part....like I said somewhere else....WOW!
Sorry to any Harley loyals out there,but I'm new to this machine and I do not have deep pockets. See what happens when you live in the pacific northwest in the winter and all it does is RAIN!
I need a great day of riding and i'll be fine.:biker::blahblah:

 

[Glyder]

Harley Davidson should at the very least do a inspection of the cam-chain tensioners + cam bearings...of course free of charge one time to a current owner of the TC.88ci motors and if they are questionable then one can proceed from there.I heard somewhere that Harley doesn't even recommend any periodic chk. of these components...mmm! imagine that! Now I'm not a hatter of Harley's,but I do remember back in the 80's when they lobbied for the import tariff's on Japanese bikes that helped them from possibly going under...at least that's the way I heard it. I paid that extra cost on 5 of my Japanese motorcycles,because at the time I wanted to go fast and not wrench on them when I parked them in the garage,but they did get their act together with the rubber mounts and more dependability. I've always loved the wide glide models from day one and now believe it or not I am the proud owner of a 99 dyna WG.
All I can say in closing is ANY HD.dealer that wants to charge me $1400.00 to install the cam chain tensioner upgrade kit is crazy!
Seems like a S#@T load of money for a $500.00 part....like I said somewhere else....WOW!
Sorry to any Harley loyals out there,but I'm new to this machine and I do not have deep pockets. See what happens when you live in the pacific northwest in the winter and all it does is RAIN!
I need a great day of riding and i'll be fine.:biker::blahblah:

Don't know where you got your info but it's well known that the TC88 needs to have the cam chain tentioners checked and adjusted at regular intervals. The $1400 install I think you're talking about is a performance upgrade to geared cams for increased power. I believe the cost for a regular adjustment is about $400-500. You may be thinking about the 96CI TC that replaced the 88 - they changed to a self adjusting cam chain tensioner that does not have a recommendation for adjustment.

 

[THE ROAD]

I've heard it said and even read somewhere that the best year models of Harley's was 2000-2003 . Seems those were the years that Harley didn't scrimp on quality parts like crankshafts & bearings ( cam chains & shoes ) are the exceptions )!
Don't know if any truth to this , maybe someone with in the know will chime in .

 

["99"WG.]

Well with a "99" maybe I'm closer than I think to the 2000-2003 quality of parts,i'll open up the cam cover and see whats up!:biker:

 

[jgetz80]

I was readying your post and thats what happened to my bike. It was so bad. I had my engine sent out to get refurbished. Good luck with it.


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[Dave63]

Don't know where you got your info but it's well known that the TC88 needs to have the cam chain tentioners checked and adjusted at regular intervals. The $1400 install I think you're talking about is a performance upgrade to geared cams for increased power. I believe the cost for a regular adjustment is about $400-500. You may be thinking about the 96CI TC that replaced the 88 - they changed to a self adjusting cam chain tensioner that does not have a recommendation for adjustment.

Speaking of where one gets their info.......

No cam chain is "checked and adjusted" at the regular intervals. Only checked.

Gear driven cams don't produce more power either. Its just a design that doesn't use a chain and keeps a better cam overlap time vs chain driven as they lack chain slack under valve spring loads.

Cam chain tensioners aren't "adjustable" whether they're the spring style1999-2006 or hydraulic 2007-present. Both are self-adjusting and always have been.

Primary chains are adjustable and need service pre-2007. In 2007 (2006 Dyna) they're auto-adjust models.

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[EpicDadIsEpic]

Is this a problem in all TC88 motors? Or is it specific to a certain class of Harley (dyna, softail, etc)?

 

[Kainam]

All stock TC 88/96/103, unless the inner cam bearings were replaced with Torrington.

 

[SoftailBilly]

All stock TC 88/96/103, unless the inner cam bearings were replaced with Torrington.

Kainam, You mention 96/103 motors, have issues with inner cam bearings. Have not heard that...? Mine are stock.

 

[Kainam]

All stock inner cam bearings are INA.

I replaced mine with Torrington when I went with the hydraulic cam plate & SE oil pump upgrade.

Parts store charges the same as the dealer, ~$15 for a pair.

PN# 24018-10 for 2 Torrington B168 for 07 and later TC + 06 Dyna
PN# 24017-10 for 2 Torrington B148 for 99 - 06 TC (05 Dyna)


https://shop.newcastlehd.com/part/24018-10


http://www.harley-davidsonforums.com/forums/engine/31860-cam-bearings-you-need-know.html#post515738