Harley Davidson Forums banner

1 - 20 of 34 Posts

·
CRSO
Joined
·
345 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
I've read a few threads on this forum regarding 2014 Harley-Davidson owners and their new infotainment systems; one common question is "why won't my Bluetooth headset work with my boom 6.5 system?"

I'm in electrical engineering and do a lot of communications work. We currently own 2008 FLHT, and use Cardo and Sena units for intercom and music, preferring that to the Harmon Kardon stereo built into the bike. We're looking at the 2014 HD's right now, so I called Harley with a very specific question:

"On the Boom 6.5 infotainment system, which Bluetooth profiles are supported?"

Tech-support couldn't answer that question, but they had me put it in an email and they forwarded it to the manufacturer of the system, Harmon Kardon. I pointed out that any Bluetooth profiles would be included in the original manufacturing specification documents between Harley and Harmon.

I received a reply yesterday; it indicated the Bluetooth profiles currently supported are:
HFP
A2DP
AVRCP
MAP

Immediately I understood why a Bluetooth headset won't work with the 6.5 system.

HFP is hands-free profile; this is for interfacing a cell phone to a hands-free kit in a vehicle.

A2DP is advanced audio distribution profile; this is for streaming audio between a media device and a (vehicle) radio.

AVRCP is for remote control of the radio/media player; it allows a remote device to pause, skip, fast-forward, etc. on music tracks.

MAP is message access profile; it's used to exchange messaging data between a cell phone and a radio. This is typically used in vehicle systems for displaying (or speech to text if supported by software) of SMS messages.

What was NOT listed in the specification was HSP-headset profile. This is why your Bluetooth headset won't work with the 6.5 infotainment system.

As many people with recently manufactured cars have discovered, like Ford Sync users, if you're on speaker phone in your car and you turn your headset on, the headset will grab control the phone from the car. The same thing happens with the new HD audio system with the current firmware.

There are other things HD shared with me on the specification document, like what services within those profiles are supported, but it gets too technical for most people at that point...The only ray of hope Bluetooth headset users have at this point is that there could be a firmware update in the future that adds additional profiles (like HSP).

I wouldn't hold my breath on this one, unless a lot of people put pressure on Harley to get Harmon to write a future firmware update.



Sent from Motorcycle.com Free App
 

·
Rookie for life
Joined
·
929 Posts
THANK YOU for an informative and well-written explanation. It certainly doesn't surprise me that H-D and Harmon would tease owners with a half-baked technological advance.

I wouldn't hold my breath on this one, unless a lot of people put pressure on Harley to get Harmon to write a future firmware update.
Wanna bet this has something to do with a forthcoming H-D Boom! branded Bluetooth headset? Wanna bet it'll feature some sort of proprietary Bluetooth profile specifically coded for Harmon and H-D (Boomtooth?) Wanna bet H-D owners with pay dearly for this "advanced" technology??

Sheesh. Just another way for the Wing Ding crowd to break our balls.
 

·
CRSO
Joined
·
345 Posts
Discussion Starter · #3 ·
That was my thinking...

But...if HD and Harmon include 2-way audio to the new headset (includes mic) and call it BlueTooth, it has to conform to the industry standard; HSP is a standard. As with most industries, there is a standards organization called Bluetooth SIG (Special Interest Group) in this case that develops the specs for profiles and services.

It's interesting what some BT gear manufacturers do...Sena supports TWO headset profiles in our SMH10s. This means you can pair two cell phones, or (as Sena was smart enough to do) use it as a platform for their Universal Intercom feature, that allows Sena and non-Sena headsets to communicate, and still pair to a phone.

This way you can have a phone and another headset user (intercom) on the same system...up to hundreds of meters away in the case of an intercom for bike-to-bike.

I will be watching the new Boom headset and will be very interested to see how they implement it...a firmware update to the 6.5 would be mandatory if they include mic audio.


Sent from Motorcycle.com Free App
 

·
Fat Guy on the Ultra
Joined
·
5,388 Posts
Now my question is, if it were to include the hsp profile, would yhe current hardware support dual support so you could ha e the phone and headset paired or would it be one or the other, not both at same time?
 

·
CRSO
Joined
·
345 Posts
Discussion Starter · #5 ·
The hardware would probably support it...adding profiles and services for porting is all a function of the firmware, which you rewrite when you do any flash upgrades to the radio.


Sent from Motorcycle.com Free App
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
27 Posts
Range master thanks for running this down it's the answer I was looking for. Yes I'm sure if they decide to have this in the future it will only fully work with one brand of headset. I seen BMW do this with there new bikes. Sucks for people that have already bought a good headset but hey what can you do.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
60 Posts
Great education! Thanks! I was just thinking about this yesterday and was wondering. :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
43 Posts
Ok. I'm a bit confused. I'm new to this Bluetooth stuff but my phone works with my bike but wanted to add Bluetooth to my helmet. Is there a certain unit I should buy???
 

·
Keep on Ridin’
Joined
·
8,054 Posts
Ok. I'm a bit confused. I'm new to this Bluetooth stuff but my phone works with my bike but wanted to add Bluetooth to my helmet. Is there a certain unit I should buy???
I'm not sure if you are wanting to have your phone connected to your bike's system and your helmet at the same time. Sena makes a Bluetooth transmitter, SM10 SM10, which is a "Dual Stream Bluetooth Transmitter". Supposed to be able to connect a source device, such as a phone, to it and it can pair the bluetooth transmission to 2 devices at the same time -- such as 2 bluetooth helmet headsets or 1 headset and the bike's bluetooth sound system. If you only want to connect your phone to your helmet, you wouldn't need the SM10; you only need the SMH10 helmet headset.

That may be what you're looking for? My Road King doesn't have audio, so I use the Sena helmet headsets and I love them.

--
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
27 Posts
Depends on what you want out of your Bluetooth head set? The headset will not do anything with the bike audio system. The only way to use the systems on the bike is with the wired headsets. Now you can Bluetooth your phone to the bike and use the wired headsets to to talk on your phone and listen to music from your phone. Or you can use the USB hookup to charge your phone and listen to the music that way. But you can't use the Bluetooth headsets to talk through the bike say the CB or use voice activated features like with the Nav system. At least I couldn't find away to do it. Maybe if you have one of these Bluetooth things to plug into the radio and then connect to it you can use those things still but I haven't been able to actual find anyone who has done this.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1 Posts
Can you connect the bike (2014 Boom audio 6.5) to a headset (Scala Rider or Sena) via the A2DP protocol? If so, this would allow you to stream music from the Boom Audio system on the bike to your intercom via its A2DP connectivity. Then you would still be able to pair your phone and intercom so that you can use the phone functionality. You would still be unable to use the bluetooth intercom capability with the bike (voice commands), but you would be able to listen to music from the bike and make phone calls.
 

·
CRSO
Joined
·
345 Posts
Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Just tested the SMH10 with latest firmware with 2014 Boom 6.5GT radio:
1. Will not pair in A2DP only mode.
2. Will not pair in multipoint pairing mode.

While the bike sees the Sena unit when you attempt to pair, pairing always fails.

Until/unless HD/Harmon Kardon fix this issue with a firmware update that adds Headset Profile to the new Boom series radios it will not work.

I expect Cardo users will have the same experience...


Sent from Motorcycle.com Free App
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
15 Posts
I got a call this weekend and i answered it with the Sena but I did notice the display on the bike recognized the name and number of the call even though i was using the Sena to talk.
 

·
CRSO
Joined
·
345 Posts
Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Cool...I think I know why, and I'll confirm this in the morning with my 2014 Ultra Limited, iPhone 4S and Sena SMH10...

Let's say you have a car with a speakerphone kit built into the stereo (HFP - Hands Free Profile), paired to your phone; let's also assume you have a standard BlueTooth earpiece you use for everyday walking around, also paired to your phone (HSP- HeadSet Profile). Your PHONE supports connections on both HFP and HSP. The CAR only supports HFP, not HSP.

You start your car, and it immediately establishes a link to your phone for speakerphone use. As a matter of fact, if you go start your car to warm it up it will hijack your phone as soon as the car BlueTooth system comes online.

You drive down the road and someone calls you...the phone and speakers in your car ring, and (if your car supports it) the car radio displays caller ID, etc.

You decide not to answer on the car speakerphone, but turn on (or tap the connect button on) your earpiece...and the call is routed to the earpiece (in HeadSet Profile); you car display may show something like "In Privacy" (Ford Sync does this) as long as you use the earpiece for the call. You can also accept the call with the speakerphone, then turn on your earpiece and it will transfer to the earpiece as well...

The HD/HK infotainment systems should do exactly that...act like a car speakerphone.

The BlueTooth comms stack on your car radio won't allow you to port music from the car stereo/built-in navigation system/satellite radio to your earpiece, because the Ford (Bose, Chevy, Motorola, etc) car radio doesn't support HeadSet Profile, only Hands Free Profile.

This is precisely what the Harmon Kardon Infotainment system acts like, with the addition of a CB radio and intercom - it only plays audio over HARDWIRED devices (like the speakers or hardwired HD headsets), and only accepts audio for comms via the HARDWIRED microphones.

Until HD comes out with their OWN BlueTooth headset for helmets I doubt they'll be adding HeadSet Profile to the firmware in the Boom system...unless an overwhelming number of
2014 (and 2015) owners impress upon the MoCo this is something we want and need.

We paid the money, we took the bikes home, we love them...just write a darn firmware update, PLEASE!!



Sent from Motorcycle.com Free App
 

·
Outlaw Nipple Poster
Joined
·
2,872 Posts
LOL. I can barely get my phone paired in my truck and cars let alone bluetooth my skoot. :) I know all that stuff is there, but all I use is the GPS, the intercom and my thumb drive with all my jams on it.

Ronnie
 

·
Call me Gig.
Joined
·
3,964 Posts
I've noticed two problems with my iPhone 5s and the 6.5 Boom.

I paired my phone and the music works through it fine. Since I neither want nor need to talk to anyone while I'm riding I set it for music only, no phone. The problem is the bike doesn't remember that setting after being shut down for any amount of time.

My second problem is that the SMS doesn't work. Not even the auto-reply which I have set to "On my bike. Will reply when I get a chance." With the auto-reply off I still don't see text messages which actually would be sort of useful even though I'd reply only when stopped.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1 Posts
2014 Street Glide Same Problem

I have a 2104 Street Glide Special and a Schuberth
C3 Pro helmet with the SRC communications. I've tried for days to get it to work with the bike and no luck. I called Schuberth tech support and they haven't figured out why it won't together. I doubt they are as up to date as you on the mapping.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
27 Posts
Wrgiacona the auto reply doesn't work with iPhone. It's a issue with the iPhone not allowing the bike to work with it not the bike not allowing it. So that one is all on apple. You should be able to hear the text message while on the road. There is a safety issue about not being able to read the text message while going down the road. Along with all the other features they turn off while the bike is in motion. Are you seeing the new message icon on the bottom of your screen saying have a new message? I believe you have to be connected to the bikes blue tooth for this to work and not just plugged in through the USB port but I could be wrong. From there when you get a text message you have to go to your phone under coms and select messages and the bike will play it through the speakers or the headset depending on how you have prompts set up. Make sure you volume is loud enough to hear prompts. It's like the gps you can only adjust it while it's playing. Hope this helps. Joseph
 

·
CRSO
Joined
·
345 Posts
Discussion Starter · #19 · (Edited)
UPDATE...I GOT THE SENA SMH10 TO WORK ON PHONE CALLS.

OK, finally got a few moments to test some things.

I figured that if the Infotainment system is nothing more than a hands-free car kit adapted to a motorcycle, I'd test out this sequence using my Ford Explorer with Sync and my helmet...sure enough it works.

Test setup:

IPhone 4s, latest firmware revision
Sena SMH10, firmware version 5.1
2014 FLHTK, 6.5 Infotainment system, latest firmware.

Paired the iPhone to the SMH10, full functionality (intercom to other Senas, music from phone, GPS turn-by turn from phone, Siri functional, etc). Turned Sena headset OFF.

Then I paired the iPhone 4s to the Infotainment system via BlueTooth. HD radio plays media, makes/receives phone calls (it expects mic audio to come from hardwired HD headsets). Full .access to phone address book. Caller ID shows up on HD display. Turned bike OFF.

After all the pairing was completed (you only have to do the pairing once) I used this startup sequence:

a. FIRST I powered up the Sena SMH10; it immediately found the iPhone.
b. SECOND I powered up the Harley; after a short while the Infotainment system also found the phone. You'll know you're good to go because the BlueTooth symbol on the Infotainment screen will light up and you'll have a signal strength indicator from the phone.

TO RECEIVE A CALL:
I called the cell phone from the landline...

1. HD radio plays the ringtone, displays caller ID, AND you also hear the a ringtone in the Sena earphones.
2. DO NOT tap the phone button on the Sena, it won't do any good...you'll hear the caller on both the speakers and the headset, but your mic will be dead....tap ANSWER on the HD radio (push in the right-hand joystick).
3. Once the bike answers the call HOLD DOWN the phone button on the Sena headset for a second or two...it will beep, then port all phone audio (speaker and mic) to/from the Sena SMH10.

To end the call hit the phone button on the Sena again as you normally would, or kill the call from the Infotainment system.


TO MAKE A CALL:
1. You can either select someone from the phone book by using the Infotainment system, or give a Siri command from the Sena headset.
2. The phone call will connect and you'll hear the audio thru BOTH the speakers AND the Sena headset. Again, you're only hearing the phone call, your mic is not connected.
3. HOLD DOWN the phone button on the Sena for a second or two...it will beep and then port all the audio (speaker and mic) to/from the Sena SMH10.

To end the call hit the phone button on the Sena again as you normally would, or kill the call from the Infotainment system.

I think the key here is to fire up your BT headset in the helmet and let it find the phone FIRST, then power up the bike SECOND. I tried it the other way around and it didn't function as I wanted.

Of course, the utility here is you get caller ID on the Infotainment screen...if you don't want/need it, the SMH10 does fine with an iPhone anyway, don't pair it...but this way you can also play music from the iPhone over the HD speakers if you desire.

While connected to the iPhone, you can fast forward, etc. thru the music on the phone by using the left joystick controls on the bike.

This does not address the porting of music from the bike TO the BT headset, or functionality with the CB module, but it's progress :)

All you're really doing is redirecting the phone call from the hands-free kit in the bike to a BlueTooth headset (for Ford Sync users, the car display would say "In Privacy")...at no time is your mic audio being accepted/used by the HD radio.


Sent from Motorcycle.com Free App
 
1 - 20 of 34 Posts
Top